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J. M. Lakin's avatar

It takes some guts to come write for The Savage Collective arguing the side of business. I appreciate it.

There's an important distinction that's getting ellided in this response and the first two pieces. As you say, most businesses won't employ too many non-useful people for too long. But just because a job produces value, i.e. contributed to profit, and is thus worth paying for, doesn't make it good, meaningful work -- doesn't save it from being BS.

The quintessential "email job" might be for HR and ensure everyone in the office gets paid on time. That's useful to the business; critical even. It's not BS in the sense of the "value" MBAs and economists would measure. But it's BS in a grander sense: the work is not valuable intrinsically, it does not aid the flourishing of the person doing it, it does not even offer the satisfaction of accomplishing something hard (perhaps even brutalizing) like railroad construction or coal mining. No one would call mining "BS" but all office work hangs on the hairy edge of that definition. It's not about producing profit -- because producing profit is, itself, quite suspect in the larger, spiritual pursuits of human beings.

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Eric Dane Walker's avatar

Thanks for this post. A couple of thoughts:

(1) "At its core, quiet quitting breaches the trust between employer and employee. It’s akin to entering a covenant, much like a marriage, where mutual expectations and responsibilities are foundational. Quiet quitting, then, is like practicing quiet polygamy in a marriage —repurposing time and effort meant for one commitment to serve another, without honesty or consent."

I think that's a good point. But it should be counterbalanced by another: it is a myth — a sustaining myth, perhaps, but a myth nonetheless — that the purely contractual relationship entered into by potential employer and potential employee is entered into by equals. In only a thin, legalistic sense does a pre-employee "freely" enter into such a contractual relationship, and only in a similarly thin, legalistic sense is the employee "free" to leave. The contract binds, sure, and brings a host of mutual expectations and responsibilities into existence. But the relationship has a different tenor when one party has less power and less real freedom to leave — just like a marriage.

(2) "In a competitive marketplace, jobs are created to enable companies to meet real needs or solve real problems. Companies only hire people when they need them. Take a company that hires someone for a task no one really needs—soon enough, that job will be trimmed. In a competitive environment, if you’re not providing real value, you don’t survive. Efficiency is the market’s regulator, and inefficiency is not just wasteful but fatal."

Again, good point. But I think the term "bullshit jobs" has been used ambiguously to refer to (a) bullshit positions and to (b) necessary positions with bullshit shadow work. You argue that the former don't really exist, because they don't last long in a competitive environment. Fine. But that doesn't mean the latter don't exist.

I have a necessary and valuable position, but my role is increasingly encrusted by tasks with no real value, and often those very tasks make it harder for me to perform the other tasks that make my position necessary and valuable. A typical bullshit shadow task will contribute to the *appearance* of value but not the *existence* of it. A bit more specifically: one kind of valueless task will, in essence, require me to spend time and energy trying to measure my contribution according to reductive, simplistic, bureaucratically legible metrics and then reporting my measurements. I spend time and energy providing the firm with things it can show others, or itself, to make it *appear* effective, which keeps me from doing things that would make the firm *be* more effective.

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